*WARNING: This podcast mentions suicide, sexual abuse & trauma and may be triggering.
Episode Summary
In this conversation, Lisa and Natasha explore the complexities of compound grief and the layers of trauma that we all face in today's world. They discuss the importance of acknowledging personal and collective grief, the impact of external stressors, and the necessity of setting boundaries for self-care.
The dialogue emphasizes the significance of community support and the need for open conversations about mental health, ultimately highlighting the journey of healing and hope amidst overwhelming challenges.
Episode Sponsored by The HelpHUB™
Struggling with your mental health? Feeling lost, overwhelmed, or just alone? Well, you're not. Welcome to The HelpHUB™—your online destination for mental health resources, treatment options, content, and tools to help meet you exactly where you are in the moment. Visit TheHelpHUB.co to get started.
Takeaways
- Compound grief is a layered experience that can feel overwhelming.
- Disassociation and brain fog are common responses to trauma.
- It's important to acknowledge the collective stress affecting everyone.
- Setting boundaries is essential for self-preservation and mental health.
- Finding grounding techniques can help navigate overwhelming emotions.
- Engaging with supportive communities can foster healing.
- It's okay to take a step back from consuming news and information.
- Prioritizing grief can be challenging but necessary for healing.
- Emotional release, such as crying, can be therapeutic.
- Hope and connection are vital for moving forward in difficult times.
Chapters
00:00 Navigating Heavy Conversations
03:01 Collective Grief and Emotional Exhaustion
05:58 The Impact of Political and Social Divisions
08:51 Personal Boundaries and Self-Preservation
11:59 Finding Balance in Information Consumption
14:53 Raising Empathetic Children
18:03 The Role of Community and Activism
20:46 Understanding Different Perspectives
23:52 The Importance of Emotional Safety
26:34 Hope for Humanity's Resilience
39:21 S4 E2 Compound Grief
Mental Health Resources
- If you or someone you know is struggling, please call 988 for help.
- The Survivors Podcast Website – https://thesurvivors.net/
- The HelpHUB™ – Mental health resources, tools, and support networks – https://www.thehelphub.co/
- National Domestic Violence Hotline – Call 1-800-799-SAFE (7223)
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See you next week! In the meantime, keep surviving.
00:00:00 --> 00:00:05 Hey, friends, before we dive into this week's episode, just a heads up.
00:00:05 --> 00:00:09 Our podcast talks about suicide, sexual abuse, and other trauma,
00:00:09 --> 00:00:13 and some of what you hear may be triggering. So please listen with care.
00:00:14 --> 00:00:19 This is The Survivors, real stories, raw conversations, and the truth about
00:00:19 --> 00:00:21 what it means to keep going after the hardest things.
00:00:22 --> 00:00:25 We're so glad you're here. Let's keep surviving together.
00:00:27 --> 00:00:32 So you know that term, compound grief? You and I have talked about it.
00:00:32 --> 00:00:36 Very familiar with that term. I was going to say that's an understatement.
00:00:36 --> 00:00:43 So I've been thinking a lot about that. A lot about having one thing layered
00:00:43 --> 00:00:44 on top of another and another.
00:00:44 --> 00:00:51 And, you know, because you've kind of been there supporting me through it for
00:00:51 --> 00:00:55 a while that, and I've been supporting you through your, I have had a loss recently.
00:00:55 --> 00:01:00 You've had losses recently on top of losses, on top of trauma,
00:01:00 --> 00:01:09 on top of just life events. you've moved, you've got, you know, your own stress.
00:01:10 --> 00:01:18 And I'd just been thinking about this idea of the grief and stress that compounds
00:01:18 --> 00:01:24 on us and how that looks to navigate through every day.
00:01:24 --> 00:01:30 And I feel like this kind of goes hand in hand in a lot of ways with the conversation
00:01:30 --> 00:01:35 we had last week about like when the world around you is just feeling so overwhelming.
00:01:36 --> 00:01:40 Well, this isn't like the external world around you necessarily.
00:01:40 --> 00:01:45 This is more like your own little world and the traumas and stresses and anxiety
00:01:45 --> 00:01:47 that you have that layer.
00:01:48 --> 00:01:53 God, compound stress can be rough. It really can.
00:01:54 --> 00:01:59 And I feel like there are so many people who are kind of quietly struggling
00:01:59 --> 00:02:05 through it without really realizing what they're struggling through that that's what it is it's just.
00:02:06 --> 00:02:09 Layer upon layer of stuff
00:02:09 --> 00:02:13 that you just keep packing on top of yourself well i
00:02:13 --> 00:02:16 think what a lot of people don't realize is it's called disassociation or
00:02:16 --> 00:02:19 brain fog where your body and your brain literally just
00:02:19 --> 00:02:23 shuts down and you're just going through the motions you
00:02:23 --> 00:02:26 kind of feel like a corpse in
00:02:26 --> 00:02:30 a way is the best way to describe it where you're just this being
00:02:30 --> 00:02:33 moving through day to day and there's no joy
00:02:33 --> 00:02:36 there's no it's just you're going through
00:02:36 --> 00:02:38 the motions of life and so corpse or
00:02:38 --> 00:02:41 zombie i just yeah zombies it's like
00:02:41 --> 00:02:45 wow that was really final more accurate yeah a
00:02:45 --> 00:02:48 zombie where you're just going through the motions of life because it's too
00:02:48 --> 00:02:55 heavy absolutely that is compound grief where your your body has literally experienced
00:02:55 --> 00:03:01 too much loss too much trauma too much grief that it can't function at a normal
00:03:01 --> 00:03:04 level and it shuts down all your higher functions.
00:03:04 --> 00:03:06 And that's where the brain fog comes in.
00:03:07 --> 00:03:12 And it's like, your body's like, no, we're just going to focus on breathing,
00:03:12 --> 00:03:15 eating, maybe getting some sleep in there.
00:03:15 --> 00:03:22 Beyond that, we can't go about that. So that's where the brain fog is.
00:03:22 --> 00:03:28 And I didn't know that for a long time until I experienced the loss of four
00:03:28 --> 00:03:30 family members in a five-month period.
00:03:31 --> 00:03:35 Yeah, well, I think that's the reason why it's been so on my mind lately,
00:03:35 --> 00:03:40 because we lost my mother-in-law last month.
00:03:40 --> 00:03:45 And like what you and I talked about last week, we've all been dealing with a lot of.
00:03:46 --> 00:03:51 Collective stress and trauma just because of the world around us.
00:03:51 --> 00:03:57 And, and then, you know, we've, we've had other losses in our,
00:03:57 --> 00:04:05 in our life lately that have been hard and heavy and have distracted you from
00:04:05 --> 00:04:07 kind of the normal day-to-day rhythm.
00:04:07 --> 00:04:11 And I don't know about you, but just when, when any one of those things,
00:04:11 --> 00:04:16 like, like a stressor of any kind, whether it's a move, like you just went through
00:04:16 --> 00:04:20 or it's a loss, like I'm going through, like any one of those things can derail you.
00:04:20 --> 00:04:27 But when you have no recovery space between the things that you are going through
00:04:27 --> 00:04:29 and the traumas or the losses,
00:04:30 --> 00:04:37 that's where you just get completely disoriented and you can't function.
00:04:38 --> 00:04:43 I've been noticing that in myself a lot lately and I feel like having a conversation
00:04:43 --> 00:04:48 like this where it puts it out into the world for other people to recognize
00:04:48 --> 00:04:50 within themselves is a powerful,
00:04:50 --> 00:04:56 I just think it's a powerful tool for you and I to use to have these conversations
00:04:56 --> 00:04:58 out loud where other people can be like,
00:04:58 --> 00:05:01 oh, that's what's happening to me.
00:05:01 --> 00:05:07 That's why I feel so disconnected or so completely either depressed or depressed.
00:05:08 --> 00:05:11 Frozen and unable to to
00:05:11 --> 00:05:14 move in one direction or another or even
00:05:14 --> 00:05:20 indifferent where you're just like i don't care one way or the other positive
00:05:20 --> 00:05:27 there's there's zero emotion i i can't seem to get excited about things i can't
00:05:27 --> 00:05:33 seem to feel sad about things i am so just like level right now yeah Yeah,
00:05:34 --> 00:05:36 numb, 100%, numb right now.
00:05:36 --> 00:05:43 And I know that is just my body's way of coping with too much change in a short amount of time.
00:05:44 --> 00:05:48 And I know that there's light at the end of the tunnel. I've experienced that.
00:05:49 --> 00:05:54 And so I just have to be kind to myself and give myself a lot of grace and just
00:05:54 --> 00:05:58 not expect myself to show up with sunshine rainbows and unicorn farts.
00:05:58 --> 00:06:05 Yeah. No, you can't. You really can't. And I think that we all experience the
00:06:05 --> 00:06:10 effects of compound trauma or grief in so many different ways,
00:06:10 --> 00:06:12 like definitely the blur,
00:06:12 --> 00:06:18 definitely the numbness, for sure, where you just kind of can't move from where
00:06:18 --> 00:06:20 you are in that moment or make decisions.
00:06:20 --> 00:06:25 But it's also, I think a lot of other people I know get very short-tempered
00:06:25 --> 00:06:33 because it frays on their nerves, because there's too much to manage, too heavy to carry.
00:06:34 --> 00:06:38 People not only will shut down emotionally, but I think other people go the other way.
00:06:38 --> 00:06:42 And tempers get really, really short.
00:06:42 --> 00:06:48 People start getting forgetful. You can't retain that blur kind of becomes an
00:06:48 --> 00:06:53 overall sense of not being able to connect with anything.
00:06:55 --> 00:06:58 My own experience with it is...
00:06:59 --> 00:07:04 You almost don't know what to deal with first, so you shut down. Mm-hmm.
00:07:04 --> 00:07:09 Absolutely. When you're dealing with multiple types of traumas or grief all
00:07:09 --> 00:07:15 at one time, how do you even know which one to focus on, which one to prioritize?
00:07:16 --> 00:07:20 Sometimes you don't. You just have to let yourself feel it in the moment.
00:07:20 --> 00:07:25 And having lost so many family members in such a short time where it's like,
00:07:25 --> 00:07:29 I need to grieve this one person but then another one dies and then another
00:07:29 --> 00:07:32 one dies and it's just like it,
00:07:33 --> 00:07:38 And so, excuse me, I listen to music a lot.
00:07:39 --> 00:07:42 I don't know if I've talked about this a lot before. Yeah, you have. You've mentioned it.
00:07:42 --> 00:07:48 Where it's like, I know that I need to process something, and I need to deal with it.
00:07:49 --> 00:07:53 And I will listen to a particular song that will remind me of that person.
00:07:54 --> 00:07:56 And like a good, ugly cry.
00:07:57 --> 00:08:01 Because trapped emotions, as we've talked about before,
00:08:01 --> 00:08:04 I don't know if we talked about that, but it will manifest and so
00:08:04 --> 00:08:08 holding these feelings and thoughts and emotions in
00:08:08 --> 00:08:12 is going to have a negative impact on you in the future and
00:08:12 --> 00:08:15 so and also the numbness sets in because it's
00:08:15 --> 00:08:18 too much to handle all at one time and so
00:08:18 --> 00:08:21 if you could just kind of take a little bite of the grief
00:08:21 --> 00:08:24 and say okay or just
00:08:24 --> 00:08:27 allow yourself a moment because a lot of people will just push it
00:08:27 --> 00:08:30 away because it's too much and they'll just like not even
00:08:30 --> 00:08:33 think about the person that they've lost and so if
00:08:33 --> 00:08:36 you'll be like okay just allow yourself to think about like maybe
00:08:36 --> 00:08:39 happy memory that you had with your mother-in-law like maybe
00:08:39 --> 00:08:42 something that you guys cooked together or just a
00:08:42 --> 00:08:45 little happy memory and just allow yourself to
00:08:45 --> 00:08:48 be in that moment with her and and
00:08:48 --> 00:08:52 to miss her and to be sad that she's not
00:08:52 --> 00:08:55 here to experience that with and just just
00:08:55 --> 00:08:57 a little tiny 10 15 you know five ten
00:08:57 --> 00:09:00 whatever you can muster at that moment to
00:09:00 --> 00:09:03 be with her because that's how we
00:09:03 --> 00:09:06 honor them moving them moving forward my favorite way
00:09:06 --> 00:09:09 to honor the people that i've lost especially the the ones
00:09:09 --> 00:09:14 that my children never met is to share memories with my children and to talk
00:09:14 --> 00:09:18 about them that's the other thing too is people those around you not knowing
00:09:18 --> 00:09:22 how to show up for you when you're grieving they're afraid to bring up the person
00:09:22 --> 00:09:26 that you've lost absolutely talk about them we We love to talk about them normally.
00:09:27 --> 00:09:30 Yeah, and I think all of that is very true.
00:09:31 --> 00:09:36 I think that when you're talking about in the context of compound trauma or
00:09:36 --> 00:09:41 compound loss, it's, well, what do I prioritize first?
00:09:43 --> 00:09:50 I think we rank our grief in a lot of ways. Well, losing, someone might think,
00:09:50 --> 00:09:55 well, losing an animal isn't as significant as losing a human.
00:09:56 --> 00:09:59 Well, if your animal was like your child, that's pretty significant. And
00:09:59 --> 00:10:06 it's hard sometimes because we have these societal constructs that tell us that
00:10:06 --> 00:10:14 certain things are ranked differently and certain things can be grieved differently
00:10:14 --> 00:10:16 or experienced differently.
00:10:18 --> 00:10:22 And I think that that muddles people's thinking in terms of how to navigate
00:10:22 --> 00:10:26 multiple traumas and losses,
00:10:26 --> 00:10:34 because you feel almost disloyal not giving one issue more thought and attention
00:10:34 --> 00:10:37 and consideration than another. Does that make sense?
00:10:38 --> 00:10:42 Yes, I do have. The look on your face, you're like, I don't know what you're
00:10:42 --> 00:10:46 talking about. Well, I had to think about it for a second, because I have,
00:10:46 --> 00:10:49 obviously, I've lost five brothers and my dad.
00:10:50 --> 00:10:54 And so, for example, Monroe, he's the most recent loss for me,
00:10:54 --> 00:10:58 and that was in March of last year. I hardly ever think about him.
00:10:59 --> 00:11:03 I don't miss him in the ways that I miss the others.
00:11:04 --> 00:11:09 Same with Klain. Klain was 12, 13 years older than me. I hardly knew him.
00:11:09 --> 00:11:12 I don't think about him that much.
00:11:14 --> 00:11:18 David, Brandon, Corey, my dad, I think about him all the time. Yeah.
00:11:19 --> 00:11:22 Well, different dynamics, different relationships, different age gaps.
00:11:23 --> 00:11:27 And, you know, a father is a completely different relationship than a sibling.
00:11:28 --> 00:11:33 Right. Yeah. So, I mean, just by nature of what the relationship was.
00:11:33 --> 00:11:37 And I do feel guilty that I don't really miss Monroe.
00:11:37 --> 00:11:41 Do you know why that is? We didn't have a close relationship.
00:11:41 --> 00:11:45 Okay. That's what I figured. Despite years of trying, you know,
00:11:45 --> 00:11:49 we had periods of time where we were close, but it was usually very short-lived.
00:11:51 --> 00:11:54 And you know when somebody's not very good to you
00:11:54 --> 00:11:58 for the vast majority of your life it's kind of hard to to
00:11:58 --> 00:12:01 miss that yeah yeah i mean
00:12:01 --> 00:12:07 when when everything all at once which is the nature of compound trauma when
00:12:07 --> 00:12:12 it all comes at you all at once and you're just weighted under the the layers
00:12:12 --> 00:12:13 of all of these different things
00:12:13 --> 00:12:20 what helps you feel like you personally helps you feel more grounded?
00:12:21 --> 00:12:26 Do you change your expectations, your own personal expectations about how you
00:12:26 --> 00:12:28 deal with these traumas?
00:12:29 --> 00:12:33 Do you let go of any parts of it?
00:12:33 --> 00:12:41 Do you ask for help? What helps you feel grounded when you feel overwhelmed by the weight of,
00:12:42 --> 00:12:47 all of these different things at once. This is where I talk about where I allow
00:12:47 --> 00:12:49 myself to feel whatever emotion it is that's coming up for me.
00:12:50 --> 00:12:56 Which I think is such a powerful reminder to everybody that we have to be exactly
00:12:56 --> 00:12:57 where we are in the moment.
00:12:59 --> 00:13:04 Yeah, so the most recent experience I had was probably about a month or two
00:13:04 --> 00:13:08 ago, where somebody in my office, it was his laugh or something,
00:13:08 --> 00:13:12 it sounded like Brandon, and it just floored me.
00:13:12 --> 00:13:18 Your brother, yeah. Yes, and oftentimes with me specifically,
00:13:19 --> 00:13:22 I, you know, we've talked about this before where I forget that they're all gone.
00:13:23 --> 00:13:27 You know, that's me compartmentalizing. I forget. I can operate through my day-to-day
00:13:27 --> 00:13:32 life without realizing and carrying around the weight of five of my brothers and my dad are dead.
00:13:33 --> 00:13:39 And so then I'll have something trigger me in a memory or whatever it is,
00:13:39 --> 00:13:40 and then I'll be like, oh yeah, he's gone.
00:13:40 --> 00:13:42 And then it's just a flood of
00:13:42 --> 00:13:49 like oh yeah they're all dead and and if it gets too overwhelming for me,
00:13:50 --> 00:13:55 I'll just cry. Literally just a good, ugly cry.
00:13:56 --> 00:13:59 And it will floor me for the rest of the day or even a few days.
00:13:59 --> 00:14:06 And I just allow myself that grace and that time to realize this really sucks.
00:14:07 --> 00:14:14 And allow myself to miss them and to realize that it's never going to be the same.
00:14:15 --> 00:14:17 And just to feel whatever emotions that come up.
00:14:17 --> 00:14:20 And then that's where all the different stages come up. And then I get angry
00:14:20 --> 00:14:26 and then I oscillate between it's okay, you know, they're not in pain anymore, yada, yada.
00:14:26 --> 00:14:29 And it's feeling so many different emotions.
00:14:29 --> 00:14:31 And I just, honestly, I kind of just let it fly.
00:14:32 --> 00:14:37 And it kind of feels a little chaotic. But as long as I allow myself to feel
00:14:37 --> 00:14:40 whatever it is that's coming up in the moment and not bury it,
00:14:40 --> 00:14:46 I generally can seem to pull out of it a lot quicker the more times that that happens.
00:14:47 --> 00:14:53 Yeah, and I think that that's just an important takeaway to all of this is that,
00:14:54 --> 00:14:59 We can't outrun these emotions. We can't outrun these traumas.
00:14:59 --> 00:15:01 They catch up with us eventually.
00:15:02 --> 00:15:07 And it does make an awful lot of sense to just really allow yourself to be in it in the moment.
00:15:07 --> 00:15:18 But I think with so much layered on top of what may already be affecting us,
00:15:18 --> 00:15:24 when you're talking about all these different layers of loss and grief and anxiety and stress,
00:15:24 --> 00:15:27 I think that there's this numbing effect.
00:15:28 --> 00:15:36 And I feel personally like that's a hard place to dig out of because it's paralyzing.
00:15:36 --> 00:15:39 It's paralyzing when there's so much there that
00:15:39 --> 00:15:42 you just don't you don't know how
00:15:42 --> 00:15:46 to move out from under it and I think that that's where it
00:15:46 --> 00:15:49 becomes really important when you're dealing it's one thing if you're dealing
00:15:49 --> 00:15:59 with a trauma a loss you know and an issue that is kind of a finite issue you
00:15:59 --> 00:16:02 can wrap your head around you can kind of cycle through it when you're talking
00:16:02 --> 00:16:05 about all things coming at you from all different sides,
00:16:06 --> 00:16:09 that's when you have to get help.
00:16:09 --> 00:16:14 That's when you have to, yes, one thing to let yourself feel it and experience
00:16:14 --> 00:16:19 it and express it, but there's another thing altogether different when you can't
00:16:19 --> 00:16:23 manage the weight of it anymore, when you get debilitated by it.
00:16:23 --> 00:16:26 That's when you have to talk to someone, whether it be,
00:16:27 --> 00:16:34 you know, a safe partner or a family member or a therapist or a lifeline or
00:16:34 --> 00:16:38 a text line or any kind of a platform that might offer you like,
00:16:38 --> 00:16:42 you know, like just a place to hold that space.
00:16:42 --> 00:16:45 I think we forget that those places are out there.
00:16:46 --> 00:16:50 Looking for mental health resources that actually fit who you are and where
00:16:50 --> 00:16:53 you come from? Then you need to check out the Help Hub.
00:16:53 --> 00:16:57 It's not another generic wellness site. It's a free, inclusive,
00:16:57 --> 00:17:01 online platform built for real people living real lives.
00:17:01 --> 00:17:08 People managing stress, anxiety, depression, trauma and abuse, grief or suicide loss.
00:17:08 --> 00:17:12 At the Help Hub, you'll find the resources, tools, treatment options,
00:17:12 --> 00:17:16 and trauma-informed content you need in the moment without having to dig through
00:17:16 --> 00:17:19 endless tabs or start from scratch.
00:17:19 --> 00:17:25 It's your place to land, to take a breath, and to find exactly what you need when you need it most.
00:17:26 --> 00:17:30 Visit thehelphub.co where the help you need is just a click away.
00:17:35 --> 00:17:38 Yes and i for and and
00:17:38 --> 00:17:42 i say this because nothing is normal but i have
00:17:42 --> 00:17:47 because of everything i've been through because of my childhood and being forced
00:17:47 --> 00:17:52 to deal with so much on my own and then you know losing so many family members
00:17:52 --> 00:17:57 in such a short term time and when a licensed compound trauma therapist,
00:17:57 --> 00:17:59 this is literally her specialty,
00:17:59 --> 00:18:04 told us, I'm sorry, I don't have any advice for you.
00:18:04 --> 00:18:08 I can be a sounding board for you, but I don't have any advice for you.
00:18:09 --> 00:18:12 I'm like, why do I need to talk to you then?
00:18:12 --> 00:18:17 It basically made me feel so alone in what I was going through.
00:18:17 --> 00:18:23 I was like, I'll just continue to do what I'm doing here and work through it
00:18:23 --> 00:18:28 on my own, Which is what I've done 95% of my life is work through shit on my
00:18:28 --> 00:18:30 own and on my own timeline.
00:18:30 --> 00:18:34 And so I realized that that doesn't necessarily work for everybody else.
00:18:34 --> 00:18:39 And I absolutely encourage everybody to go to therapy and do the hard work and
00:18:39 --> 00:18:43 talk to somebody. Absolutely. And...
00:18:45 --> 00:18:49 You have to decide what works best for you. And for the vast majority of my
00:18:49 --> 00:18:53 life, just working through it on my own has been what's worked for me.
00:18:54 --> 00:18:58 Yeah, and I think a lot of people can say that. I think a lot of people have
00:18:58 --> 00:19:03 experienced the same reaction that you experienced.
00:19:03 --> 00:19:07 But the other thing, too, is when you're going into therapy,
00:19:07 --> 00:19:11 maybe you're someone who's listening to this conversation and you're like,
00:19:11 --> 00:19:14 you know, I have a lot of compound trauma in my life that I need to sort through.
00:19:15 --> 00:19:19 Whatever it is that you're choosing to go to a therapist for,
00:19:20 --> 00:19:25 it's kind of a, you're setting yourself up to be disappointed with the assumption
00:19:25 --> 00:19:30 that that therapist or counselor is going to hand you, spoon feed you,
00:19:31 --> 00:19:35 write out for you, here's what you do, here's how you fix it.
00:19:35 --> 00:19:40 That's not what therapy is in most cases.
00:19:41 --> 00:19:48 It is having a person be a place to hold space, a safe place to express what's
00:19:48 --> 00:19:53 weighing you down and what might be causing you pain.
00:19:54 --> 00:19:58 I think so many people have that false perception that, like,
00:19:58 --> 00:20:00 oh, they're just going to tell me what to do.
00:20:00 --> 00:20:05 And that's the, you know, that'll be ideal because then there's my solution.
00:20:05 --> 00:20:08 But that's just not how it works in most cases.
00:20:09 --> 00:20:14 Right. And that's when I realized that talk therapy was not going to be effective for me any longer.
00:20:15 --> 00:20:19 There was too much. And so I had to move to EMDR therapy.
00:20:19 --> 00:20:25 Yeah. You know, there's so many different options available as far as therapy
00:20:25 --> 00:20:28 goes. It's almost kind of like dating.
00:20:28 --> 00:20:32 You have to find the therapist that works for you and you have to find the method that works for you.
00:20:33 --> 00:20:37 And so I want to tell, you know, encourage people to research the different
00:20:37 --> 00:20:40 kind of methods there are or to talk to your therapist about,
00:20:40 --> 00:20:45 hey, what are some other options if you feel like talk therapy is not just enough for you?
00:20:45 --> 00:20:51 Because there's so many different options out there that can really help be helpful.
00:20:51 --> 00:20:55 And I wanted one of the things I wanted to ask you is, you know,
00:20:56 --> 00:20:59 you're dealing with the loss of,
00:20:59 --> 00:21:05 you know, a sudden loss of your mother-in-law and you had just a couple of months
00:21:05 --> 00:21:07 ago, you lost a childhood friend.
00:21:07 --> 00:21:11 And then I know that you carry your dad, the loss of your dad with you on a daily basis.
00:21:12 --> 00:21:17 And so what do you do to manage that compound grief that you just carry with
00:21:17 --> 00:21:20 you and it just continues to stack up on top of you?
00:21:22 --> 00:21:23 I mean...
00:21:24 --> 00:21:27 Lately, it's been hard. I'll be fully transparent.
00:21:27 --> 00:21:33 Lately, it's been really, really hard. In the case of just the most recent loss
00:21:33 --> 00:21:36 of my mother-in-law, I mean, it happened so fast.
00:21:36 --> 00:21:43 You know, she took a fall very unexpectedly at home, and that really was the
00:21:43 --> 00:21:47 catalyst for everything to start kind of derailing.
00:21:47 --> 00:21:50 And within two months, she was gone.
00:21:50 --> 00:21:56 But within that two-month period, it was a lot of hospital stays and a lot of,
00:21:56 --> 00:22:00 you know, flying back and forth down to Florida. And it was a lot of rehab time
00:22:00 --> 00:22:05 and watching her decline very suddenly. And you can't get your bearings.
00:22:05 --> 00:22:08 I'm still pretty numb, to be honest with you.
00:22:08 --> 00:22:11 I mean, she's been gone a couple of weeks at this point, two,
00:22:11 --> 00:22:12 three weeks at this point.
00:22:12 --> 00:22:17 And while my family is, everyone's talking about it and everybody's open and
00:22:17 --> 00:22:22 supportive, I haven't been doing a lot for myself in that way.
00:22:22 --> 00:22:28 And I actually said to Dave recently, this week, that I feel a little lost.
00:22:29 --> 00:22:35 I really do feel a little lost because, you know, one, when you've had losses,
00:22:36 --> 00:22:43 multiple losses in your life consecutively, another one just opens up the other wounds.
00:22:43 --> 00:22:50 The other ones become more amplified, even if they're like my dad 47 years ago,
00:22:50 --> 00:22:52 you know, lost him 47 years ago.
00:22:53 --> 00:22:55 I don't know if that answered your question about what I'm doing.
00:22:55 --> 00:22:58 I'm not really sure what I'm doing right now.
00:22:58 --> 00:23:02 You're in the numb phase. I am. I really am. I think I'm really just at this
00:23:02 --> 00:23:06 point kind of trying to stay the course, trying to keep myself busy for better or for worse,
00:23:07 --> 00:23:11 not really giving myself an awful lot of time to rest my brain or rest my heart,
00:23:12 --> 00:23:15 which I just realized recently I was doing.
00:23:15 --> 00:23:24 And now I'm like, okay, I need to handle that differently. I need to actively shut down.
00:23:24 --> 00:23:32 I've always been kind of of that mindset that I need to keep constantly busy
00:23:32 --> 00:23:37 as a way of putting energy into something of purpose.
00:23:38 --> 00:23:42 But what I sometimes forget is that what needs the energy more than anything
00:23:42 --> 00:23:48 is just my ability to recover from the sadness or the grief or the loss.
00:23:48 --> 00:23:56 And so, you know, I'm definitely trying to consider where I'm at and give myself
00:23:56 --> 00:23:58 a pause more actively right now.
00:23:59 --> 00:24:02 And that's why I've been asking you, what are you doing for you?
00:24:02 --> 00:24:05 I know. I know. And you do. You ask me that all the time.
00:24:05 --> 00:24:10 And honestly, I don't know, because I've been kind of going through the motions
00:24:10 --> 00:24:15 lately. I have a lot of work-related things that, you know, you never want to
00:24:15 --> 00:24:18 just drop the ball on the things that you're involved in.
00:24:18 --> 00:24:21 And sometimes you don't have a choice.
00:24:21 --> 00:24:23 The ball is put down for you.
00:24:24 --> 00:24:26 I don't do that very well.
00:24:27 --> 00:24:34 And so I don't know I'm kind of in an ambivalent place right now Where I'm just
00:24:34 --> 00:24:38 I'm doing the things that In some ways are making my heart feel good Like throwing
00:24:38 --> 00:24:40 myself into meaningful,
00:24:40 --> 00:24:44 impactful things And spending time with people who are important to me And staying
00:24:44 --> 00:24:48 connected with my family Who makes, you know We're all going through the same
00:24:48 --> 00:24:50 thing So it gives you some kind of comfort in that way.
00:24:52 --> 00:24:55 Yeah. And just being open and just talking about it. And just a lot of crying
00:24:55 --> 00:24:59 has happened lately. An awful lot of crying has happened.
00:24:59 --> 00:25:03 And, you know, it's miserable in the moment because there's nothing worse than
00:25:03 --> 00:25:04 like, you know, the ugly cry.
00:25:04 --> 00:25:08 But at the end, there's also nothing better than the ugly cry.
00:25:08 --> 00:25:14 So there's been a lot of that. A lot of emotional release that gets to happen.
00:25:14 --> 00:25:21 And I have experienced firsthand multiple times, actually, when I push through the grief too much.
00:25:22 --> 00:25:25 I don't know if I shared this before, where I, after I lost my dad,
00:25:26 --> 00:25:29 so Corey passed away in November of 2022.
00:25:30 --> 00:25:33 Six weeks later, my maternal grandfather died of old age.
00:25:33 --> 00:25:38 And then two weeks after that, my dad died of cancer. So literally in eight
00:25:38 --> 00:25:40 or ten weeks, we lost three people.
00:25:41 --> 00:25:45 And I was at the forefront of planning Corey's and dad's funeral,
00:25:45 --> 00:25:50 along with my sister, and just me getting in there, getting things done.
00:25:50 --> 00:25:53 And I had a, it's called a TIA.
00:25:54 --> 00:25:59 It's kind of like a mock stroke. And my brain literally shut down because I
00:25:59 --> 00:26:04 was going too hard and was not allowing myself and my body and my heart time to rest.
00:26:04 --> 00:26:09 And so that experience alone has taught me that I like just keeping yourself
00:26:09 --> 00:26:16 busy to distract yourself from the grief can have some pretty serious negative ramifications.
00:26:16 --> 00:26:23 And so once I had that happen, I've no longer pushed myself through the grief
00:26:23 --> 00:26:29 and just have learned to allow myself to be and to no longer keep busy as a way of distraction.
00:26:30 --> 00:26:34 Yeah, I'm a little more set in my ways than you are, because you're just such
00:26:34 --> 00:26:39 a little young'un compared to me. You're like a baby compared to me.
00:26:39 --> 00:26:46 So I'm way more set in my ways in that way. And that's always been my default.
00:26:46 --> 00:26:54 It's just to be productive. And it's because I always get such a strong feeling
00:26:54 --> 00:26:58 of balance when I am doing something
00:26:58 --> 00:27:01 that's productive and meaningful and impactful and all those things.
00:27:01 --> 00:27:05 And so that helps my heart in lots of ways, but it can be deceiving too,
00:27:05 --> 00:27:10 because you can kind of fake yourself out and make yourself believe that by
00:27:10 --> 00:27:12 throwing yourself into what you're doing,
00:27:13 --> 00:27:17 it's the right thing for you to do until all of a sudden you realize that you're
00:27:17 --> 00:27:23 still feeling just as sad or triggered or depleted as you were before.
00:27:23 --> 00:27:25 And that's the thing that I've,
00:27:25 --> 00:27:31 kind of been realizing, like, I haven't had a loss that's been a loss quite like this in my life in.
00:27:32 --> 00:27:37 Decades, where someone, I mean, you know, this is 40 years almost that she's
00:27:37 --> 00:27:42 been my mother-in-law, and such a close bond and connection.
00:27:42 --> 00:27:47 And, you know, you talk to someone every day, they're a part of your everyday life in every way.
00:27:47 --> 00:27:55 And then all of a sudden, they're not there. And it is really hard to know what to do for yourself,
00:27:55 --> 00:28:02 especially when you've got other kinds of compound losses or traumas or stress
00:28:02 --> 00:28:05 going on around that, on top of that.
00:28:05 --> 00:28:12 So, I mean, I think this whole conversation just boils down to paying attention
00:28:12 --> 00:28:16 to yourself, like really asking yourself the hard questions and then really
00:28:16 --> 00:28:20 being honest with yourself when you're answering them.
00:28:20 --> 00:28:23 Like I'm really being honest with myself lately saying, you know what,
00:28:23 --> 00:28:27 I don't really know what I need. I don't really know what to do for myself.
00:28:27 --> 00:28:32 Like I would love to sit here and say to anyone listening, I have all the answers for you.
00:28:32 --> 00:28:36 I don't. And I certainly don't have all the answers for myself.
00:28:36 --> 00:28:39 But I am doing a lot of the same things that you're doing, which is to just,
00:28:39 --> 00:28:46 you know, sit where I need to sit in whatever I need to sit in and just be honest.
00:28:46 --> 00:28:52 Every day, the last several days, I've been asking myself the same handful of
00:28:52 --> 00:28:55 questions, which is like, how do I really feel?
00:28:55 --> 00:28:58 What do I really need?
00:28:59 --> 00:29:05 And the answers have been way more honest than I've allowed myself to give for a long time.
00:29:06 --> 00:29:11 And so it feels like I think that's a path forward for me.
00:29:11 --> 00:29:14 And hopefully that kind of thing, being open and honest with ourselves,
00:29:14 --> 00:29:17 can be a path forward for anybody who might be listening to this conversation.
00:29:17 --> 00:29:24 Who's just got a lot of things compounding on each other and making life hard.
00:29:25 --> 00:29:28 Because a lot of us are dealing with that kind of thing.
00:29:29 --> 00:29:32 That's exactly what I wanted to hear out of your mouth, darling.
00:29:32 --> 00:29:34 Well, see, we got there, right?
00:29:35 --> 00:29:37 We got there. That's why I've been like, how's your heart?
00:29:38 --> 00:29:41 No, I know, I know. That's been like my go-to with you lately. How's your heart?
00:29:42 --> 00:29:45 I know. And you know what? I asked my sister-in-law the exact same question
00:29:45 --> 00:29:49 today. And she's like, meh. And she's like, how about you? I'm like, meh.
00:29:49 --> 00:29:53 You know, and, you know, we all want to feel better.
00:29:53 --> 00:29:56 We all want to be better. We don't want to be under the weight of the things
00:29:56 --> 00:29:58 that we are under. Nobody does.
00:29:58 --> 00:30:03 Especially when there are multiple things that you're struggling with at one time.
00:30:03 --> 00:30:07 But all you can do is just be real about what those things are and the effect
00:30:07 --> 00:30:08 that they're having on you.
00:30:08 --> 00:30:11 Cause you can't fake yourself out. There's like no fake out for it.
00:30:12 --> 00:30:16 So I've, I've tried to answer your questions very honestly when you ask me and
00:30:16 --> 00:30:19 I love you for asking every time and.
00:30:20 --> 00:30:23 It's been different every time, right? Like some days I'm like, you know what? I'm good.
00:30:24 --> 00:30:29 And some days I'm not. So I think. Some days you feel like a trash panda.
00:30:29 --> 00:30:34 Yes. I do. I don't even know what that is. It's a raccoon. Oh,
00:30:34 --> 00:30:36 a raccoon. Oh, that's Utah humor.
00:30:37 --> 00:30:42 Isn't it? Is that, is that F-L-D-S humor? Is that what that is? No, I'm kidding.
00:30:43 --> 00:30:48 No, I didn't even know that is, that is a universal thing. I didn't know that.
00:30:48 --> 00:30:50 I grew up in the Northeast.
00:30:50 --> 00:30:53 It's a raccoon. They're called trash pandas. Okay. Well, I think it's adorable.
00:30:54 --> 00:30:57 I know. I'll just cycle that into my vocabulary. I used that a lot when I was reading.
00:30:58 --> 00:31:01 I was like, I just feel like a trash panda because there's no color.
00:31:01 --> 00:31:02 They're black and white.
00:31:06 --> 00:31:10 And pandas, like actual pandas are just very cute.
00:31:11 --> 00:31:13 You know, but then there was the garbage layer on top of it.
00:31:14 --> 00:31:17 Yeah, no, I get it. I see what you're trying to say. I see what you're trying
00:31:17 --> 00:31:19 to say. There's a whole new world for me now.
00:31:19 --> 00:31:22 You know, you leave it up to me to throw something random in there to make it
00:31:22 --> 00:31:24 funny. Right there. Right there at the 30-minute mark.
00:31:24 --> 00:31:27 It's perfect. It's a perfect way to wrap.
00:31:28 --> 00:31:35 Now, so look, we've talked about what all sorts of compound loss and grief and
00:31:35 --> 00:31:38 stress and trauma can do to us.
00:31:38 --> 00:31:44 And what we can do in response to that is really just be as nimble as we can
00:31:44 --> 00:31:51 with it and be as open to whatever it is that we're feeling in the moment as
00:31:51 --> 00:31:54 we can be and ask for help when we need it most.
00:31:55 --> 00:31:59 Absolutely. And you're not broken if you need help or if you need to talk.
00:31:59 --> 00:32:03 Like, feeling this way that you have to power through and do things on your
00:32:03 --> 00:32:07 own, we don't have to do that anymore. Those days are over.
00:32:08 --> 00:32:11 No, we do not. We absolutely do not. We just need to keep talking about it.
00:32:12 --> 00:32:14 That's all. And that's how we survive. Absolutely.
00:32:15 --> 00:32:19 Yeah. All right. Let's come back next week. Let's talk about something totally
00:32:19 --> 00:32:21 different next week. Sounds good.
00:32:21 --> 00:32:24 All right. I'll see you then. Take care. Okay, honey. Bye.
00:32:25 --> 00:32:29 Thanks so much for listening and for being part of the Survivors community.
00:32:29 --> 00:32:34 No matter where you are in your story, you're not alone and you're definitely not broken.
00:32:34 --> 00:32:38 Healing takes time and it looks different for everyone. the fact that you're
00:32:38 --> 00:32:42 still here and still trying means you're already doing the hard work,
00:32:43 --> 00:32:47 If something in today's conversation resonated with you, please share it with
00:32:47 --> 00:32:48 someone who might need to hear it too.
00:32:48 --> 00:32:53 That's how we keep these conversations going and remind each other that there's always hope.
00:32:54 --> 00:32:57 And if you or someone you know is struggling, please remember,
00:32:57 --> 00:32:58 help is always out there.
00:32:58 --> 00:33:03 You can call or text 988 anytime to reach a trained crisis counselor like me.
00:33:03 --> 00:33:06 And for more mental health resources, tools, treatment options,
00:33:07 --> 00:33:10 and content to support your mental health, visit thehelphub.co.
00:33:11 --> 00:33:14 We're so grateful you're part of the Survivors family, and we'll be back next
00:33:14 --> 00:33:18 week with another honest conversation about life after the hardest things.
00:33:18 --> 00:33:22 Until then, take care of yourself and your people, and keep surviving.